I am going to PUMP

Inept_Fun · Since 14 Apr 2005 1417 Posts Hood River XTreme Poster

YOU UP!!!!!!!!

Wtf is with all these pumps posts lately? Cmon ppl it just fills your kite with air!!

Gman · Since 11 Feb 2006 4911 Posts Portland Unstrapped

Fetch the defibulator!

Also what about those pesky lines and all that walking -
6m line sets Thumb's Up

pdxmonkeyboy · Thu Apr 09, 09 10:53 am

well, the plastic pumps just aren't legit anymore. People need to push the envelope and start using alternate ways to inflate their kites if we want the sport to progress.

up down, up down, up down...freakin weak man.

KITE LOW AND ELECTRIC PUMPS!!

DROCK999 · Since 31 May 2007 852 Posts Left Coast Opinionated

tinyE · Since 21 Jan 2006 2004 Posts not really an XTreme Poster

tekko · Since 20 Feb 2006 376 Posts White Salmon Liquid Force

Kite pumps are as cheap and cheesy as they are because of cost. Period.

They are as effective as necessary while being able to be produced with lowest cost to get job done.

Everyone expects pumps to come with every kite. Well, in the increasing costs of production, there is little to no incentive to make a pump that does or costs any more, as it would only increase the end price of the product- the complete kite.

This is why it is open to a small company or do it yourselfer to create a better product that you may decide to purchase. But that is the key, you would have to want to purchase this pump for anyone to be able to produce and sell it.

If everyone decided that pumps shouldn't come with kites, the kites could be a little cheaper and riders would invest in the level and quality of pump they choose to purchase, from a variety of manufacturers... but this probably isn't going to happen any time soon, so we'll keep putting the same pumps in with the kites.

Really, this is the current limitation on most products in our sport. You would be amazed at where boards could go with advanced composites, lot's of CNC time, etc, but who here would pay $1500 for that board? Bars and Safety systems.. another key area that could be pushed so far, but already people hate paying $400 for a bar system.. who would be willing to pay $600 for their bar, putting their complete kite well over $2000, even for an 8m.

The market will continue to grow and influence product development at the rate the consumer allows and demands by what they willing to pay. If everyone wanted cheaper, well the market could go that way too, you'd just give up many over looked beneficial features, such as one pump, deflate valves, graphics, quality pigtails and all of the reinforcements you often don't notice but that hold a quality kite together... (edited: this is a general statement and doesn't refer to any kite or brand specifically, just rant about market dynamics influencing products that are available)

I'd love a better pump. But unfortunately I am unwilling to pay $100 for it.. or actually $50. Instead, I'll continue to use the painstaking method of the normal pump that came with my kite.

mschulz · Since 29 May 2007 530 Posts Reno, NV Addicted

New business opportunity:

Have someone at all the local spots that run around with their pumps and pump your kite up for you - $5 for 0-12m and $10 for 13+. We will call them the “Pumper Uppers” If you are willing to double the price, you may even get a best girl to do it while you watch.

tonyb · Thu Apr 09, 09 12:13 pm

Hey Greg! Party Foul!!! Evil or Very Mad

I usually ignore the Best bashing and this will probably get the lockdown but I think you're off base with your comment on the Waroo. I rode '06 Waroos for 2 1/2 years and only had one bladder problem and one leading edge tear that came at the very end of that period. And I ride a LOT of hours. They weren't bottom end kites despite some people's opinion. In fact we've had extremely good durability with all of our Best kites since we started riding them in 2004.

And what's the comment about "other more reputable brands" all about? They stand behind their products and have just as good a warranty as everyone else. The only debacle they had was the Hellfish and I think everyone who bought one got their money back.

People that have moved on to other brands is probably a combination of local hook ups, riding preferences, and a little bit of peer pressure. Or maybe lack of support from their favorite shop.

In my opinion Best has their kite costs about right. A brand new 11m Waroo is $899. Or a 12m Nemi HP for $1149 vs a Rev 2 11m for $1749. And their isn't any difference in durability or build quality. They use the same fabrics and they come from the same factories in China.

And yes all the pumps suck. Quit selling them with the kites and let people buy them separately. I must have 8 or 9 of the things in my garage.

My favorite pumps: Liquid Force, North and Eclipse because they are the taller version. (haven't found a tall Slingy laying around yet Wink

) But my guess is they all come from the exact same factory in China.

Sorry for the rant but I get tired of the unfounded bashing. Come down here and lets go kite some waves together. Smile

Tony

Inept_Fun · Since 14 Apr 2005 1417 Posts Hood River XTreme Poster

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9fWfxrPQG5U

tekko · Since 20 Feb 2006 376 Posts White Salmon Liquid Force

Tony,
Good to call me out didn't mean it that way or mean to go there. Just got on a rant and hit submit.

That statement regarding any specific brand has been removed and noted in the original post.

Don't mean to take away from any one or any brand, was only ranting about the market dynamics influencing what products and their cost:quality:price formula.

Sorry to have offended. Really didn't intend to note or bash any brand.. it just kind of slid in there while at the end of the rant, which was completely unfounded.

My only real point being, there won't be a better pump until everyone is willing to pay for a better pump.

pdxmonkeyboy · Thu Apr 09, 09 12:43 pm

stringy · Since 23 Jun 2006 1738 Posts vancouver XTreme Poster

tekko,
thanks for the response.
You are right on in regards to the market demand.
Most will continue to either accept the product or complain about it. Not many will want to pursue a better product if the market is not willing to pay for it.
Believe me I have a million, well not a million, ideas and have the resources to put any of them into action and create a product but will the market demand be there for what I'm willing to sell the product for?
I doubt it. At least not in today's market.
I'll keep using what's available.
If designing a better pump made me more competitive and help push me beyond everyone else, I would probably redesign and build a better product.
But for now, I accept the product for it's shortcomings as it still get's me on the water.

stringy

pdxmonkeyboy · Thu Apr 09, 09 1:35 pm

Stringy, If you can make a better pump for less than $50 I would buy one. It's taller, a little larger in diameter and has a switch that you can flip and make it inflate only on the downstroke.

That would be money!!

hebrew_hammer · Since 27 Dec 2006 31 Posts Â

yo jim,
how about a double cylinder pump with gearing! Shocked

ie. 1 pump stroke = 5 or so strokes of the actual pumping shaft
then you hit single stroke mode switch to pressurize it.
A roughing pump pass and a finishing pump pass!

ya just pump up your kites you lazy asses.

barfly · Since 31 Mar 2005 1216 Posts Portland BRACKISH

trevorsmith · Since 25 Apr 2005 501 Posts PDX Addicted

pdxmonkeyboy · Thu Apr 09, 09 2:12 pm

my penchant for stroking aside...

I modified one of my pumps to only pump on the downstroke because it seems that it is the pulling up motion (especially when the kite get some pressure in it) is what really tweaks my back. With the one seal removed, it is much easier to just use your body weight to push the pump down.

You don't really notice that your pumping twice as much on smaller kites because you get a nice long; some would say deliciously long, stroke on it. But if you use the single stroke pump on a big kite...ugggh, seems like your pumping forever.

Take one of the little rubber valves out and try it, you can easily put it back in if you don't like it.