Before you buy new gear, something to think about

lloyd · Since 16 Aug 2007 108 Posts Hood River Stoked

I know we're not supposed to do brand vs. brand threads. I understand and agree with that policy, but sometimes an issue comes up that is important enough that it needs to be discussed. I hope the value of my message will be taken with the intent in which it is communicated.

Last year I was involved in a life threatening kite accident at Rowena where I was lucky to escape with "only" a shattered collarbone and elbow. I was self launching with brand new, never used before gear and got launched across the rocks. From the beginning, it seemed to me that there was something wrong with the kite. Turns out, there was. My brand new kite was assembled with the incorrect bridal. I was flying an 8m kite with a 12m bridal installed. Essentially the front lines were 18-22" longer than they should have been, thus, giving the kite no depower and making it sit far back in the wind window.

I put a lot of research in to my new kite in the months prior to my purchase. I settled on the 2013 Caution Spitfire. I wanted to support a smaller company, and to be honest, the lower price was a factor. They acknowledged that the kite was faulty and they replaced the kite.

I never would have considered whether or not the company I was buying from was insured or not. I guess I just assumed that they all would be. Turns out Caution does not carry insurance, because they aren't required to. When I asked them for help in covering some of my medical and other expenses (totally approx. $65,000) I have been left with unanswered emails. Although there is a really strong case, attorneys aren't interested in taking on the case because Caution is not insured. "Can't pull blood from a turnip" kind of situation. Without insurance, the payout is not enough to interest any attorneys.

In talking with some of the local shop owners here in Gorge, the larger kite brands not only carry insurance for their product, but they also provide coverage for the retailer. Something that Caution does not do.

As you venture out and consider your kite purchases for 2014, please take the lesson from my experience and ask if the product or shop is insured. Most of us have careers, families and kids and kite because it's fun and something we enjoy. You should buy from a company that understands that and has you as the end user protected.

The bummer of the whole thing is that the Caution Spitfire is a really nice kite for the Gorge. It flies and does exactly what I wanted it to do. Unfortunately, I can't recommend it to anybody because of the liability of dealing with Caution. Spend the extra money upfront on the more popular brands and if something does go wrong, have confidence in the fact that they won't leave you high and dry.

Forever here forward, my decisions on what gear to buy will involve more research in to what kind of company I am supporting and whether or not me and my family are protected.

Thanks,
Lloyd

Justsmile · Since 20 Jul 2009 1523 Posts Not Portland XTreme Poster

Glad u r all healed up and ur back on the water. That accident has not slowed you down a bit. Can't wait to catch up again:-) take care buddy and stay safe!!

Blazeheliski · Since 30 Mar 2011 655 Posts Mosier Addicted

Good post. Something I never even considered. Thanks for sharing and happy to hear that you are back on the water!

registered · Since 12 Jul 2005 1319 Posts tsunami Sandbagger

So what companies do insure.....

Slingshot??
Scary dose of this extreme sport with cheap overseas product assembly by people who don't kiteboard most likely.

Great post ...... where did personal responsibility go tho...

Guess maybe we need to pre flight test and launch with close bystander help to abort when flying new to you gear old or new. ( i do)

The more complicated the gear is for safety sake the harder it is to easily see the issues that may exist because of more system pieces.

KISS
Keep It Simple Stupid
The 05 fuels... bar and all were the ideal set up imho.

OG · Since 07 Jun 2011 537 Posts Addicted

if the company sold this to you in a way that renders the equipment faulty or does not perform in the way it is supposed to, it seems to me that they should some how be accountable. Otherwise, what is it that we are trusting companies for with the products we buy. Im not going to get all soap box'd and go on a brand jihad post, but phuk!!

Kinda agree with registered on the pre flight for new gear component as it relates to personal accountability. I feel pretty strongly about having some air time with 'new to me' gear. I can also say that when it has come to getting a sesh vs missing it, getting the sesh always wins.

I hope in all of this that the right thing is done somehow or the other. Id also like to hear about the follow on outcome.

lloyd · Since 16 Aug 2007 108 Posts Hood River Stoked

Hi Registered. I agree that besides there being a responsibility of the manufacturer, there is also a responsibility of the end user to be familiar with the gear. I assure you that I spent adequate time checking out the kite in my own yard before ever attaching a line to it. I've self launched exclusively for the past 4 years, including the very same spot inwhich the accident occurred, never with a problem. Without the spec sheet in hand, there was no way of knowing the appropriate lengths of the bridal lines. Afterwards, it wasn't until I went over the kite with a fine tooth comb, specifically looking for too long of a bridal, that I found it.

You'd be surprised at how fast shit hits the fan when a kite is this out of tune. I hope no one ever has to experience it. There could have been 100 people helping me launch, and the result would have been the same. 10 mph wind or 40 mph of wind. When a kite flies that deep in the power zone and when fully depowered is still fully powered, there's no chance for any recovery. It isn't until the beating stops that you take your hands away from protecting your head and face and activate the safety. It's also tough to hit the safety when your chest and front side are the places getting drug across the rocks.

Accidents happen. I've worked assembling things before, I completely understand how these manufacturing mistakes happen. The ultimate proof of a company is not only in the quality of the product they produce, but how they handle the truest of unfortunate accidents that do occur.

Yes, Slingshot is insured and they insure the retail store. They have taken their fair share of lawsuits. They too make mistakes. But in the end, the end user has been protected and Slingshot continues to be in business and have many happy customers.

lloyd · Since 16 Aug 2007 108 Posts Hood River Stoked

Hi OG. Agreed. They should be responsible. When a company is insured, you file a claim with their insurance company and the insurance company does the fact finding and determines the amount of responsibility and suggests a settlement. You can take that settlement or argue for more, usually with the help of an attorney. Without insurance, you either hope the company steps up and does the right thing, or you have a choice to sue. Suing is an out of pocket expense.

There's the choice.

My medical insurance would be the first thing to get reimbursed, then pay off attorney fees, then pay for professional witnesses. The question becomes, is there anything left for me?

In this case, it would be a personal lawsuit. I would have to be awarded $100,000 just to cover my expenses.

Getting awarded that amount is not a concern, but them being able to pay that much is.

There really is no way to make them accountable. It sounds nice to think so, but in the end the numbers don't work out for me. All I can do is pass along the message and hope the experience doesn't happen to anyone else.

Lesson learned. Insurance protects everybody.

beech · Since 21 Aug 2010 483 Posts Longview, WA Obsessed

self launch at rowena in 8m conditions is super mega sketchy. you are a very lucky man. glad youre still amongst the living!!

bwd · Since 04 Aug 2007 385 Posts Obsessed

Buy your own insurance.
Be your own insurance.
Take risks YOU can afford.
Best wishes all for 2014

SpaceRacer · Since 04 Nov 2007 434 Posts Obsessed

Lloyd, thank you for posting this. This is something I never thought about. When buying new or used gear, taking it for some kind of test ride in the safest conditions possible is a wise thing to do. I am glad you are on the mend and kiting again. IMHO I think Caution is liable for your damages and you should pursue a fair and just settlement. Kite companies should spend less money on bikini clad models and more money on quality control. Thanks for posting.

SR

jerp · Since 22 Feb 2013 450 Posts Obsessed

thank you for posting.... lots of food for thought

lekaks · Since 02 Apr 2008 151 Posts Hood River, OR Stoked

Caution. At least they got the name right.

jerp · Since 22 Feb 2013 450 Posts Obsessed

has anyone ever found the quality of the bar or lines being poor right out of the bag?

Lurk · Since 04 Apr 2009 355 Posts Obsessed

Thanks for the valuable info. Glad I buy SS. One of the best post
's ever. BWD.. how do you buy insurance for a kite manufacturer error? At what cost? You heard that we can't control everything that happens. Next time someone gets shot in a mass shooting tell it to them a la Sandy hook kids.
Oh wait those 5 y.o. s shoulda armed themselves.

bwd · Since 04 Aug 2007 385 Posts Obsessed

OK, douche. Leave the psycho shooter's victims out of it.

re: kiting and risk, risk is assumed by the kiter.
Insurance, warranties, etc. are only somewhat effective at addressing some of the risk.
That's the important part to remember.
The $ risk of injury needs to be part of the risk benefit decision about participating.
Ever notice the kiter population tends to include a lot of people who either have plenty of money (and insurance) or a pretty high risk tolerance?
There's a reason for this.

I can empathize with injured kiters. I can also see that the reality is the decision was made, and responsibility for the risk was taken, when the kite was launched.

sfbomber · Since 27 Jun 2012 112 Posts Stoked

I think all companies that sell bridled kites should publish the dimensions of their kite's bridles, either on their website, or come in the manual. Your accident is yet another example of why.

bwd · Since 04 Aug 2007 385 Posts Obsessed

^True.
Careful pre-flight check, and a "test-flight" of any new or modded gear in benign conditions, with a hand on the release is also a very good idea.
I can't blame the injured kiter for seeking compensation for the negligence of the bad bridle. But the negligence is more correctable at an earlier stage.