Is the used kite market saturated and flat?

SpaceRacer · Since 04 Nov 2007 434 Posts Obsessed

I routinely buy and sell used kites. I recently bought a premium brand 11m for $750, that is literally in mint condition. As such, I put another premium brand 2013 12m in excellent condition on the market for $850, which I have slowly reduced to $700 and after two months, 1 hit and no takers. Normally when I sell a used kite, it sells within a few weeks. Just wondering if you have had similar experiences lately. Good for buyers!

SR

toddjb · Since 16 Oct 2007 271 Posts MD Obsessed

I've noticed the same thing and had wondered what is going on. I have a used kite listed now and they usually go very quickly. I have one bite so far and it's been up for 2 or 3 weeks.

Maybe the new kite market is saturated. A local guy just bought a couple brand new 2013 Best kites from Real for 450 each (with pump, no bar). Could just be a Best thing, but still...why buy used when you can get new kites that cheap?

The minnow · Since 26 Jan 2009 395 Posts argentina Obsessed

I do believe the market of used kites is very flat;
Here in Argentina the amount of used gear is incredible!
I believe the market is more for zones ,<regional?> as premium sales'.
Seems some brands are popular depending on where you ride and who is the supplier .
I am very concerned with all the new light weight , low strut count or no strut deal , as making test monkeys out of riders;
If the kite does not relaunch just eject and swim in;? save your board!!
I do believe some older models of kites where the true deal;
And shorty you will see companies do reissue kites for lack of new ideas!!
Just like skate boarding with all the reissues, they have came full circle and come out with old ideas as being new;
If your just getting started in kitting and don't spend months researching the whole deal you would think the companies are incredible; and some are!!
D>P>

SalmonSlayer · Since 27 Nov 2005 648 Posts Addicted **CGKA Member**

Yes it is flat, Kites last longer and kite design has flattened out, so there is a larger pool of acceptable kites made 2008- 2014 as opposed to 2002 - 2008. I typically will sell kites on EBAY. You will maximize exposure to the demand of your kite model, sell it in 6 days and be fairly confident you at least got a market correct price. The ~10% Ebay fee and 4% PayPal fee is worth it IMHO.

I am not expert but here are some lessons I learned from my EBay experiences.

Sell a kite and bar separately. You will reach a larger audience. Some may want just a bar and some may just want a kite. Only a subset of potential buyers will want both.

On each post, always mention the other items you have for sale. Offer free shipping on the bar if they buy both. It is the same cost to ship a kite and bar as it cost to ship a kite (USPS). This will allow the bidder to be willing to pay a little bit more for the bar if they don’t have to absorb the ~$15 cost of shipping. Also, try to offer discounted shipping for other gear combo purchases.

Include pictures of any damage/repairs with honest descriptions. It is very important to gain the trust of bidders so they will not hold back $$ due to uncertainty about the product they will receive. Take pictures of the wear points on the tips and front and rear attachment points. Close-up pics of anywhere that is a known wear point will give bidders a feel for the overall condition of the kite. ALWAYS pump up the kite to take pics and verify it does not leak and make sure you mention that it does not leak in the description. Fix any leaks or you will be accepting a deeply reduced high bid when you disclose the leak. Don’t forget a picture of the bag with the kite in it and a sentence describing the bags condition. Also include any accessories such as patch kits, manuals, stickers....

Don't be greedy. Don't be afraid to let the market work. Skip starting at $1 and putting in a reserve price. Reserve prices are a joke. Just start with the lowest price you are willing to accept, before you would rather keep the gear. If your starting price is too high, you will not show up in a bidders search, depending on their search parameters. It is the equivalent of hiding from customers. If you are not sure how to price your kite, gain some confidence by watching bids for a couple of weeks first.

You might like the "Buy it Now" feature. You can set a starting price low, but also set a price that someone can buy the item immediately at a price you are willing to accept. I like this feature because sometimes you find a buyer that will take the "buy it now" price to guarantee he will not be outbid.

Instead of reinventing the wheel with your kite description, find a similar piece of gear already posted on EBay, copy it and modify to your needs. After an honest description of the gear, add the manufactures description. If you can find product reviews, include them too.

When posting gear for auction, pay attention to when the auction closes. You don’t want it to close on Super Bowl Sunday or any other day when people will probably not be watching their bid as close. If they are sitting at their computer they are more likely to rationalize raising their bid. I am very guilty of this. I recommend ending your auction at 6PM PDT. This will give you maximum exposure to the after work, but not asleep time slot from the east to west coast.

I recommend only shipping in the lower 48 with a flat rate (if you live n the continental US). You can adjust your settings, so bidders outside the US cannot bid on your auction. In the product description, I always state "AK and HI extra. No shipping outside the US". I did not have the settings correct in my profile and had 2 Russian bidders than kept screwing up my auction. Use the slow USPS ground (please chime in if you know a less expensive way to ship). Charge ~$25 for a kite. You may eat a couple of $$ once in a while, so what!!

It is a "buyers beware" world, but if you are going to sell old gear that is not good for beginners, I think you are ethically bound to add something similar to the following. "If you are a beginner, stop here. This is not the kite for you. This kite is only for bidders that know exactly what they are buying. Bidders should be experienced Kite Borders Only". I have seen many deceptive "good for a beginner" descriptions for old kites on EBay and Craig s list. Life is too short and your integrity is too precious to spend time taking advantage of peoples trusting nature.

You can get boxes at Lowes or Home Depot for less than $2. Box size matters more than weight when shipping USPS. Pack a kite in the smallest box possible. You can fit more in a small space if you remove the kite from the bag to ship.

That is all I can recall for now

Moto · Since 03 Sep 2006 2698 Posts Still a gojo pimp! Moto Mouth

I'd say SalmonSlayer nails it.

I've been watching kites on ebay for a while to figure out what they are selling for and other trends. I'm seeing a lot of sellers post their stuff on 7 day bids with a fixed price around $700 or so (depending on kite) with a buy it now option. It takes some of them several weeks to sell - so it does take a little time.

As for the new market - I got a friend who is searching for a new quiver. He's finding some pretty sweet deals - $1,300 for a new kite. It wasn't too long ago when the listed price for some new kites was $2,500.

jeremy · Since 18 Aug 2006 276 Posts Manzo & HR Obsessed

SalmonSlayer's eBay advice is spot on.

eBay has the market. Every year I post locally (nwkite, ikitesurf, CL), maybe sell one or two items, and eventually just list it all on eBay,; and bang, it's all sold in a week, with the bonus of good prices (some less, some more, but ends up on average bringing in more money than expected).

I think another factor is all the ongoing "Closeout Deals" on last years gear (going back a few years now). New Slingshot boards and Best kites for under $500 from various retailers, definitely competes with the used market, at a minimum puts a cap on used prices. I have a beautiful 2013 board listed at $400, I feel the price pressure from someone being able to get a new Slingshot board for the same price.

SpaceRacer · Since 04 Nov 2007 434 Posts Obsessed

Awesome. Great advice Salmon Slayer. I will give it a go. Could be fun. Thanks!

SR

<Wolverine> · Since 07 Jul 2013 71 Posts PDX

I have bought and sold hundreds of items on ebay since its inception and is amazing what some people will buy. There have been countless times I would pack things to go to Goodwill only to do a check on ebay and find that there are actually people who are willing to pay more than I would have thought for something I thought was junk.

As was already mentioned don't be greedy if you want to sell it. I also will check the completed listings box to see what has sold over the past several months for several reasons. One, if I am looking for something it gives me an idea how often the item actually comes available. I can sit an wait looking for a better deal if the current items are too pricey especially if I know that it will only be a matter of time for another to come to auction. Two, will also give me an idea how much I will pay if there is an option to make an offer. Three, if I am trying to sell something I can get an idea what the item has actually sold for in the past. I price my stuff slightly below what the highest price has been and I include free shipping. Lots of people don't want to wait until the last minute and will snap it up quick. I'm not kidding!

Just bought a brand new, still in the wraps 2013 6m Naish Park for $640 including shipping.

I have a new Dakine Pyro harness for sale on nwkite but haven't gotten a bite but on ebay the same harness has sold for $30 more so it's off to ebay. A little bit of an inconvenience but I know it will sell.

bwd · Since 04 Aug 2007 385 Posts Obsessed

SalmonSlayer · Since 27 Nov 2005 648 Posts Addicted **CGKA Member**

bwd · Since 04 Aug 2007 385 Posts Obsessed

Well I may be a little opinionated, just putting out what I like to do with these things.
But yes the box size issue is the main thing to watch for as a shipper.
As a buyer I see way too many things that are small, <$100 items being hawked by some ass who charges $50 or more for shipping.
annoying, surprised it's allowed.

Once I bought a kite from a sketchball who sent it usps, took three weeks or so.
Hard to know because I think he also lied about when he shipped it and the condition.
Wrote the address on the box with some magic marker that almost totally wore off by the time I got it. Guess I was lucky i did get it.
Kind of a B list strapless bandwagon you would recognize the name...
but I digress.

Anthony · Since 07 Oct 2008 362 Posts Salem Obsessed **CGKA Member**

The Buyers perspective:
This is not an easy sport to make into a life style. It takes wind and water at times not an easy combo to find, especially if you have to travel for it. Some people buy kites all enthused at first, but they end up sitting in storage.
After two misfires I figured out how to buy kites. Kite one was an older C-Kite(pre 2006), a dangerous kite for the beginner. I donated to CGWA . The other was bought from a dealer. Good kite with problems, needed bladder(too many holes) , missing one of the bar lines and the bar was not that same that came with the kite(older bar did not have the lower safety line). It took him a year to get me a line. He was a jerk. I do not now buy used kites from dealers any more unless I can inspect it.

A few of my rules advice for newbies:

1. Do your research, pick one or two brands and get to know them well.
2. Understand what the market price is. Let the seller know you are not going to low ball them and also that you are not going to pay a ridiculous price.
3. Damage = price reduction.
4. Wear = price reduction.
5. If you’re bar lines are wound up like a monkey. Expect a price to drop. Presentation is everything( At the Windance Swap meet, I would have asked the guy to look at his kite, but if that is how he keeps this bar, it was overpriced anyway)
6. Time is money, you’re in invested in it, and so is the seller. You want a kite and the seller does not want meet another person to sell it to. If the seller does not understand that, let it go. The kite can stay in person’s garage and get less valuable.
7. If you meet at a place other than the seller’s house, seller is invested in getting it out the door. Be reasonable in the price. There is a fine line between insult and low price offer. As also there is for high prices from the seller.
8. If the sellers presentation is good. Blown up kite, nice bar and bag. I will pay them the higher end of my price range without dickering. I respect a good sale.
9. Ask questions. Where they kite? Kite use? There are some stolen kites out there? I do not want to be recipient of one.
10. If they ever say "I bought it for this much" and "I need to get this much out it". Walk away! There poor choices are not your problem.
11. Do your homework on the kite. I have seen several kites being represented as a newer kites but actually several years older.
12. If you can test fly the kite. Do it!! Getting the owners perspective on how to setup the kite will save you time.
13. There are good kite dealers that sell used equipment. They should have a rating system that meets the expectations of the customer.

Places I buy kites. Most of my kites have come from Craigslist’s. Craigslist is only for the educated buyer. Many people selling kites with little use have not invested the time on the kiteboarding web sites to understand where to sell them. There is also plenty of overpriced older kites(junk) on Craigslist. You can tell because it keeps getting re-listed. Ikitesurf is second. NW kite is third. Ebay is fourth. I have been able to get Slingshot T3’s and Rev‘s for $200 to $300 from good condition to new. I will only buy kites that are 2008 or newer to get the safety features.

Lastly buying last years model kite can offer you an incredible deal with a warranty.

Windance Crew · Since 18 Apr 2008 473 Posts Hood River Kite Shop Obsessed

We buy and sell tons of used kites here on consignment. I have to agree the market is flat, but fair. You get what you pay for. Until a new innovation hits the market (like when SLE or bow kites did) then your current used kites will hold value.

Caution - Self promotion to follow:
Ebays works if you have the time, if not then just consign it here and we do all the work.

SpaceRacer · Since 04 Nov 2007 434 Posts Obsessed

So this is interesting....I recently got two hits on my Rebels...one from the UK and the other from Ireland. The marketing major in me is so intrigued by this stuff.

Pepi · Wed Jun 18, 14 1:21 pm

Honestly, this year has been pretty strong for us in regards to selling used gear, but we do our best to filter what gear we have coming in on consignment, based on condition, locally represented brands (ie - sold in local shops) and realistic pricing (as in pricing for the buyer, not viewing your gear value like a 401K).
We have a lot of happy consignors, but consignment is not for everyone (for realistic purposes, consignments come with a selling fee and that is not for everyone).

When selling used gear it really does require patience, as you are selling something at a certain price that then needs to be found by a person looking for that certain something and having it at the price they want to pay for it.

Listings on craigslist almost certainly scream " I stole it" or "I found it in a friends garage who no longer wants it", ditto with windsurfing gear (which seems to have the most ridiculously insane selling prices from people who know nothing about their gear, on an almost comical level).

There are also some of those items that pose a greater amount of difficulty in selling due to the brand/model being either completely unknown or having a reputation for having parts/warranty/refurb issues.

Patience is the key