How is the oil explosion effecting the event site, etc.

eric · Since 13 Jan 2006 1804 Posts XTreme Poster

Worth a read. Provides some insight into the risk/reward of our three methods of inter-continental petroleum transport:

http://www.forbes.com/sites/jamesconca/2014/04/26/pick-your-poison-for-crude-pipeline-rail-truck-or-boat/#4b778aaf5777

saleeba · Since 05 Mar 2006 237 Posts Masshole Stoked

in response to Salmon Slayers post and driving car all over the NW to fuel kite addiction. My kite mobile is a VW TDI. VW runs on Oregon grown B99 (99% bio, 1%) diesel. My wife drives a flex fuel Ford Escape. Runs on E85 (85% ethanol, 15% petro). Pretty common vehicles. Flex fuel vehicles are everywhere. Most people driving flex fuel cars don't even know, or really care for that matter, what flex fuel means. Alternative fuel stations are not so common, so it takes some planning and motivation to make it work. If more folks filled up with E85 there would be more stations offering it. E85 and biodiesel are not widely available because there's no demand from consumers. Don't feel like dealing with E85 or biodiesel? Electric cars are every where! It boils down to making a choice. If you don't like oil trains put your money where your mouth is and drive an alternative fuel and/ or electric vehicle.

brass · Since 15 Jul 2006 152 Posts Stoked

I like the discussion here at least.

Unfortunately saleeba flex fuels and E85 are not the answer either. The amount of fossil fuels burned to grow the corn to produce these "alternatives" generally offsets the carbon neutrality of these options and they still need to be transported. This is to speak nothing of the ridiculous politics behind all of them.

Not sure I am aligned with Salmonslayer but the point he makes about driving less if this means something to you is valid.

and by the way there is also an awful lot of petroleum in that kite of yours and for sure fuel was burned in all steps of the process of getting that kite from the design table to your door.

How about everyone at least turns their damn car off when you get to the beach instead of idiling for 20 mins while you check the Event Site graph from the comfort of your AC cooled Audi Allroad.

saleeba · Since 05 Mar 2006 237 Posts Masshole Stoked

It is virtually impossible to live 100% petroleum free. no shit its in my kites, it's in everything! We can choose to use less of it by way of alternative fuels and electric. We can go back and forth all day.

eric · Since 13 Jan 2006 1804 Posts XTreme Poster

This really is a good discussion. I appreciate the different view points. A lot of validity to much of what is being put forth.

user124 · Since 02 Aug 2012 390 Posts Portland Obsessed

shred_da_gorge · Thu Jun 16, 16 4:14 pm

Good debate; thanks for the articles too.

"and changes have been made to insure that whatever caused this incident cannot happen again."

FYI, billions of tax dollars have been spent on a technology called Positive Train Control (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Positive_train_control). PTC is basically a wireless braking technology similar to what's being put into newer automobiles. The Amtrak derailment in Philly a few years ago was just short of getting the wayside units installed on that track segment that would have theoretically prevented that tragedy, but the political force behind PTC's adoption dates back to early crude tanker derailments, particularly one that collided with a passenger train. BTW, braking a freight train is a fairly complex endeavor, especially when you have multiple locos communicating locally to throttle their own power/traction contributions to longer and longer trains (over hills, etc.). Actually, the wireless technology to do that was the foundation of what's now PTC. And metal wheels on metal tracks... you can guess there's some math and technology involved in controlling the traction motors to efficiently get these suckers stopped and started rolling again!

Not that any of that would have prevented a little chunk of something on a track from flipping over just one car and bringing the whole shebang down with it...

stringy · Since 23 Jun 2006 1726 Posts vancouver XTreme Poster

While I haven't read every single word written in this thread, I will say that we are very fortunate that it wasn't as devastating as it easily could have been.
If any of these tanker cars had spilled into the river, it would impact everything downriver. I just donated to columbia river keepers to help support an organization that has our best interest (the river) in mind.
www.columbiariverkeeper.org

http://www.oregonlive.com/politics/index.ssf/2016/06/oregon_calls_for_indefinite_mo.html
so they halted oil tankers on the oregon side of the river. they are still running them along the wa side

I specifically purchased a TDI so I could have a high efficiency vehicle with low emissions... gonna sell it back to the dealer soon and get a hybrid!

quenyaistar · Since 21 Oct 2011 416 Posts Cougar, WA Obsessed

Top gear tested a toyota prius against a v8 bmw the priUS got 17 miles to the gallon the BMW got 19 miles to the gallon. Plus making the batteries takes lots of fossil fuel and makes lots of pollution. And hybrids are so expensive you will probably not make it back in gas savings.

Slappysan · Since 13 Jun 2012 308 Posts Obsessed

That top gear test was driving a Pruis as fast as possible on a race track and the BMW was drafting behind it just keeping pace.

So yeah, if you buy a Pruis and pin the accelerator all the time you've got the wrong car and it's not going to be very efficient.

quenyaistar · Since 21 Oct 2011 416 Posts Cougar, WA Obsessed

I would get a yaris instead of a prius. Good gas mileage, cheap and no dirty battery

voy-tech · Fri Jun 17, 16 11:47 am

Slappysan · Since 13 Jun 2012 308 Posts Obsessed

For those serious about reducing their carbon footprint while kiteboarding ... Susuki Bergman with trailer!

dude abides · Since 06 Apr 2014 52 Posts Bend, OR