Northwest Kiteboarding
Forum | Classifieds | Lost & Found | CGKA | Industry | Sensors | Forecast | Spots | Seattle | Decals | RSS | Facebook

Events | Photos | Search | Register | Profile | Log in to check your messages | Log in 

10m Wave SST First Impressions (snow)

 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Northwest Kiteboarding -> Gorge / Portland / Oregon Coast
previous topic :: next topic  
Author Message
proletariat

Since 22 Feb 2013
102 Posts
Denver, CO
Stoked



PostSun Nov 29, 15 9:55 pm    10m Wave SST First Impressions (snow) Reply with quote

Did some serious driving this weekend to find a little snow packed valley at about 9,000 ft. that had some streadyish wind. I was able to finally put the Wave through its paces, and I figured not a lot of people have been able to try it out in janky, inland winds on snow, so I wanted to share my experience.

Rigging
First, the kite's tendency to not sit flat is a real pain in knee-deep powder. We almost always self launch around here, and even when we tether to the car's tow anchor, it's still a bit of extra work to get the self-launch & rig logistics right. I ended up taking my skis down to the kite, setting one on the front of the kite while rigging, going back and running the lines (upwind, which I don't love doing), then going back to the kite, taking my ski off, setting the kite nose down and lines taut, then running back with my ski to hook in. I tried a ton of snow on the canopy, but had to sprint/tackle to stop it from flying off because the snow just wouldn't sit far enough forward to keep it down. It sure would be nice if it sat flat, but then it wouldn't be a wave, would it.

Conditions
That's about where the bad stuff stops. In this valley, there were clearly visible mini fronts coming in succession that were basically like really long wave sets. So we'd get lulls down to 0-10 mph and then the snowy set would come in and we'd get 10-25 mph sustained for a bit until the next blue-sky-lull. It was about 10m on / 10m off per set. In short, these were exactly the types of conditions I bought the Wave for. We don't get to demo kites out here, so my (crossed fingers here) theory was that a Colorado lull is a lot like when you're surfing a wave straight at the kite. The lines go slack(ish), and you just need to be able to focus on your riding without your kite falling out of the sky while you're doing so. You'd be amazed at how many "beginner" kites just fall out of the sky like a brick at the first lull around here.

Power & Grunt
Anyway, my buddy is on a 12m Cab Vector and I'm a little spooked by some of the gusts, so I put up a 10m. It ended up being a little underpowered, but absolutely perfect for my tastes. First thing I noticed is that it's not as grunty as I had expected. I certainly couldn't pull in the bar and just go, since the power at the side of the window isn't a ton. However, when you dive it deep in the power some it really generates a surprising amount of force for such a small / underpowered kite. Once moving, the Wave quickly hunkers down into the power zone and pulls with steady, predictable force. Being underpowered, I had to make sure not to let the kite get too far ahead of me or it would immediately lose its substantial power. Took me a bit to dial it in, and I flew the rest of the session with the trim fully out to help keep it back in the window.

Depower
The depower isn't quite as binary as, say, a similar sized Rally. It felt a lot smoother from powered to depowered, with like half my throw feeling "depowered" and the last quarter of my throw able to back stall the kite (which is where I like it on days like this). A couple of gusts up around 25mph had my eyebrows raising a bit when I was coming down the hill fast, but overall nothing surprised me and it probably had quite a bit more top end than I gave it credit for.

Turning
Indeed, the adverts are true. This thing turns on a dime... Very much like a Rally, but it felt smoother. Sometimes it feels like the Rally just sort of slide / pivots when you really crank it... The Wave is just more of a tight smooth turn. I never felt like I needed it to turn faster , and I had some close calls with what looked to be spiky plants. The bar out turning is really pretty killer, and it's one of the most useful features for janky inland winds. When we get a lull, it's nice still be able to move the kite back into the window even though the lines aren't taut.

Drift
This is why I bought the kite, and this proves to be its primary notable feature. We were in a narrow valley about maybe 100 meters wide with about 50 meters of that filled with a plateau that had pretty steep sides. However, if you go downwind, it's about 2 km of wide open terrain and widens out to over 300m with multi-level plateau fun. After a bit of warmup, we head back to the car, grab some provisions, and decide we're going to go on a serious downwinder (with a probable hike back upwind). So during one of the lulls, I loop a few times and then just fly straight at the kite as fast as I can. The winds were only about 10 mph, and I had to be going at least that, and the kite just drifted with me for quite a ways. A quick turn upwind, short fast loop and fly straight at it again. I was downwind in no time and I never felt that the kite was going to fall out of the sky. I can't wait to try this bad boy out on some actual water waves. Anyway, way better drift than my Rallys, and I loved the drift on those.

Air / Float
I didn't catch any air worthy of the name, but I did notice a little gap in steady power when I was "sending" it (such as it was). I might chalk that up to garbage winds or first day of the season or not going fast enough. I'll post more as I get some time on it.

Loops
As I was underpowered, getting up some of the steeper slopes was a little nerve wracking. However, even during the lulls I was able to bang out a quick loop with the Wave, as big or as small as I wanted, in order to generate whatever power I needed to get over the hump. Loops feel incredibly predictable, but still powerful. I got a little wide-eyed at some of the power I got from loops, so it's definitely not sedate, but I knew I was toeing the line when I was doing it, and didn't get punished for pushing the envelope, which is a great feature to have in a kite.

Overall Wave SST as a Snow Kite
Many, many times during my 2-3 hour session, I found myself thinking "it's like this kite was MADE for snow kiting". At one point, a hefty gust came up, and I was moving pretty fast down a huge slope with a couple of gnarly boulders and some decent line tension. I could easily have turned upwind and been immediately FAR in the air, but I wasn't ready. Instead, I banged out a huge arcing turn toward the kite on the steep section and chose to just sort of ignore the kite while I skied this section. Bar out, I banged out 3 quick turns, hit the flat bit going fast and the Wave was just sitting pretty there ready to get going again. I'm not sure where my Rally would've been, but it wouldn't have been there Smile


Sentinel Bar (AKA Dammnit, Slingshot!)
One thing I'd like to vocally complain about is the white lines that come on all slingshot Kit. My buddy skied into my lines twice, and I even had them wrapped around my boot once and didn't realize it. They are COMPLETELY invisible in snow. Both times I thought we were well clear (the 3rd was a total kook maneuver:)) Please, Slingshot, allow me to pay an extra fee for colored lines. All 3 of us snow dudes who fly slingshots would really appreciate it Smile

Also, I'm not sure about that sliding stopper / trim dealy. Sure, it was increcdibly convenient when you need to bring the rig in closer, but you can't move it back out without advanced Boy Scout skillz. It felt like it kept creeping up on me. Aside from that, though, everything on the bar is baller. I'm still kinda pissed you included bungees on the bar ends because I felt you were doing the world a service by teaching everyone the half-hitch, but I understand you must pander to the masses Smile.

Anyway, those are my first impressions. Take 'em or leave 'em, but I hope it helps someone. Can't wait to try this kite out on a coast somewhere.

_________________
Pfft... You call that a gust? Smile

View user's profile Send private message
proletariat

Since 22 Feb 2013
102 Posts
Denver, CO
Stoked



PostMon Nov 30, 15 9:39 am     Reply with quote

Part of the Kite Path. Incidentally, 513 / 42 doens't actually deserve a name. It's little more than a cattle trail. Made a nice lip for jumping, though.


_________________
Pfft... You call that a gust? Smile

View user's profile Send private message
Sasquatch

Since 09 Mar 2005
2053 Posts
PNW
Bigfoot



PostMon Nov 30, 15 10:27 am    Re: 10m Wave SST First Impressions (snow) Reply with quote

Thorough write-up for sure; meat and potatoes essay! Thanks.

And Slingshot has had years and years (over a decade) of requests for colored lines and rubber bands on the ends of their bars in order to secure a rolled up set of lines, but nothing.

I'm not sure if one could use a sharpie pen an attempt to color them for oneself? My two areas of concern would be what the dye would to the structural integrity to the lines if in fact the lines could even be colored with the waxy finish of the lines themselves?

As for the rubber bands on the ends of the bar, I use the heavy blue rubber bands that one gets when they purchase a bunch of broccoli crowns. I just wear the bands around one wrist during my session.


Proletariat wrote:
Did some serious driving this weekend to find a little snow packed valley at about 9,000 ft. that had some streadyish wind. I was able to finally put the Wave through its paces, and I figured not a lot of people have been able to try it out in janky, inland winds on snow, so I wanted to share my experience.

Rigging
First, the kite's tendency to not sit flat is a real pain in knee-deep powder. We almost always self launch around here, and even when we tether to the car's tow anchor, it's still a bit of extra work to get the self-launch & rig logistics right. I ended up taking my skis down to the kite, setting one on the front of the kite while rigging, going back and running the lines (upwind, which I don't love doing), then going back to the kite, taking my ski off, setting the kite nose down and lines taut, then running back with my ski to hook in. I tried a ton of snow on the canopy, but had to sprint/tackle to stop it from flying off because the snow just wouldn't sit far enough forward to keep it down. It sure would be nice if it sat flat, but then it wouldn't be a wave, would it.

Conditions
That's about where the bad stuff stops. In this valley, there were clearly visible mini fronts coming in succession that were basically like really long wave sets. So we'd get lulls down to 0-10 mph and then the snowy set would come in and we'd get 10-25 mph sustained for a bit until the next blue-sky-lull. It was about 10m on / 10m off per set. In short, these were exactly the types of conditions I bought the Wave for. We don't get to demo kites out here, so my (crossed fingers here) theory was that a Colorado lull is a lot like when you're surfing a wave straight at the kite. The lines go slack(ish), and you just need to be able to focus on your riding without your kite falling out of the sky while you're doing so. You'd be amazed at how many "beginner" kites just fall out of the sky like a brick at the first lull around here.

Power & Grunt
Anyway, my buddy is on a 12m Cab Vector and I'm a little spooked by some of the gusts, so I put up a 10m. It ended up being a little underpowered, but absolutely perfect for my tastes. First thing I noticed is that it's not as grunty as I had expected. I certainly couldn't pull in the bar and just go, since the power at the side of the window isn't a ton. However, when you dive it deep in the power some it really generates a surprising amount of force for such a small / underpowered kite. Once moving, the Wave quickly hunkers down into the power zone and pulls with steady, predictable force. Being underpowered, I had to make sure not to let the kite get too far ahead of me or it would immediately lose its substantial power. Took me a bit to dial it in, and I flew the rest of the session with the trim fully out to help keep it back in the window.

Depower
The depower isn't quite as binary as, say, a similar sized Rally. It felt a lot smoother from powered to depowered, with like half my throw feeling "depowered" and the last quarter of my throw able to back stall the kite (which is where I like it on days like this). A couple of gusts up around 25mph had my eyebrows raising a bit when I was coming down the hill fast, but overall nothing surprised me and it probably had quite a bit more top end than I gave it credit for.

Turning
Indeed, the adverts are true. This thing turns on a dime... Very much like a Rally, but it felt smoother. Sometimes it feels like the Rally just sort of slide / pivots when you really crank it... The Wave is just more of a tight smooth turn. I never felt like I needed it to turn faster , and I had some close calls with what looked to be spiky plants. The bar out turning is really pretty killer, and it's one of the most useful features for janky inland winds. When we get a lull, it's nice still be able to move the kite back into the window even though the lines aren't taut.

Drift
This is why I bought the kite, and this proves to be its primary notable feature. We were in a narrow valley about maybe 100 meters wide with about 50 meters of that filled with a plateau that had pretty steep sides. However, if you go downwind, it's about 2 km of wide open terrain and widens out to over 300m with multi-level plateau fun. After a bit of warmup, we head back to the car, grab some provisions, and decide we're going to go on a serious downwinder (with a probable hike back upwind). So during one of the lulls, I loop a few times and then just fly straight at the kite as fast as I can. The winds were only about 10 mph, and I had to be going at least that, and the kite just drifted with me for quite a ways. A quick turn upwind, short fast loop and fly straight at it again. I was downwind in no time and I never felt that the kite was going to fall out of the sky. I can't wait to try this bad boy out on some actual water waves. Anyway, way better drift than my Rallys, and I loved the drift on those.

Air / Float
I didn't catch any air worthy of the name, but I did notice a little gap in steady power when I was "sending" it (such as it was). I might chalk that up to garbage winds or first day of the season or not going fast enough. I'll post more as I get some time on it.

Loops
As I was underpowered, getting up some of the steeper slopes was a little nerve wracking. However, even during the lulls I was able to bang out a quick loop with the Wave, as big or as small as I wanted, in order to generate whatever power I needed to get over the hump. Loops feel incredibly predictable, but still powerful. I got a little wide-eyed at some of the power I got from loops, so it's definitely not sedate, but I knew I was toeing the line when I was doing it, and didn't get punished for pushing the envelope, which is a great feature to have in a kite.

Overall Wave SST as a Snow Kite
Many, many times during my 2-3 hour session, I found myself thinking "it's like this kite was MADE for snow kiting". At one point, a hefty gust came up, and I was moving pretty fast down a huge slope with a couple of gnarly boulders and some decent line tension. I could easily have turned upwind and been immediately FAR in the air, but I wasn't ready. Instead, I banged out a huge arcing turn toward the kite on the steep section and chose to just sort of ignore the kite while I skied this section. Bar out, I banged out 3 quick turns, hit the flat bit going fast and the Wave was just sitting pretty there ready to get going again. I'm not sure where my Rally would've been, but it wouldn't have been there Smile


Sentinel Bar (AKA Dammnit, Slingshot!)
One thing I'd like to vocally complain about is the white lines that come on all slingshot Kit. My buddy skied into my lines twice, and I even had them wrapped around my boot once and didn't realize it. They are COMPLETELY invisible in snow. Both times I thought we were well clear (the 3rd was a total kook maneuver:)) Please, Slingshot, allow me to pay an extra fee for colored lines. All 3 of us snow dudes who fly slingshots would really appreciate it Smile

Also, I'm not sure about that sliding stopper / trim dealy. Sure, it was increcdibly convenient when you need to bring the rig in closer, but you can't move it back out without advanced Boy Scout skillz. It felt like it kept creeping up on me. Aside from that, though, everything on the bar is baller. I'm still kinda pissed you included bungees on the bar ends because I felt you were doing the world a service by teaching everyone the half-hitch, but I understand you must pander to the masses Smile.

Anyway, those are my first impressions. Take 'em or leave 'em, but I hope it helps someone. Can't wait to try this kite out on a coast somewhere.

View user's profile Send private message
lewmt

Since 04 Aug 2010
182 Posts
MT
Stoked



PostMon Nov 30, 15 2:37 pm     Reply with quote

Quote:
I'm not sure if one could use a sharpie pen an attempt to color them for oneself?


I did exactly that last year - for exactly the reason Proletariat is griping about. It worked really well. Stayed colored through last season with no problems. 1 red & 1 black on the 2 steering lines. Center lines are then visible when you have something for contrast when sorting things out at the bar. This was especially frustrating because I almost never detach lines from the kite during snow season. Inevitably you have to weave the bar through the center lines to sort things out before flight but if you can't see didly its impossible.

View user's profile Send private message
toddjb

Since 16 Oct 2007
271 Posts
MD
Obsessed



PostThu Dec 10, 15 5:49 am     Reply with quote

Prol. that's a great writeup, thanks. Thumb's Up
Good tips for when I get to travel to some snow later this winter. I'll keep in mind that I need to plan ahead for weighting down the canopy. I use a snowboard so my trips back and forth to the kite are a lot more exhausting than yours in knee deep powder!

I posted a review of the Wave here and my water experience is similar to yours. The handling in light variable wind and gusts is fantastic. I can confirm that you really can forget about the kite in many conditions and focus on your riding or walking. I'm glad to hear that transfers to snow, I hadn't even though of that. Now I'm even more stoked on the purchase.

I also hear you on the Sentinel bar sliding stopper thing as I have decided to try those new bars over the Comps this year. It works great, but I occasionally find that I forget to adjust that before launch and it's too close to me. You can move it closer while it's flying, but it's a little tricky/sketchy to move it away. (you have to unweight the front lines by grabbing above the cleat, then you can push it or pull it. mind your kite...) Shocked

That said, I think if this bar also had a traditional sliding rubber stopper it'd be everything I need. I love the below the bar manual swivel, but I really have also come to utilize the sliding stopper on the Comps when I want the kite to temporarily behave in a particular spot without bar attention (adjusting straps/bindings or unmanned tether at the edge of the wind window). It's a lot harder to get a kite to sit unattended without the sliding stopper, using only the trim strap, as when you let go of the bar it is going to sheet out to the cleat.
Any reason you couldn't add a sliding stopper to the Sentinel bar?

View user's profile Send private message
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Northwest Kiteboarding -> Gorge / Portland / Oregon Coast All times are GMT - 8 Hours
Page 1 of 1

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You can attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum