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Foil theory 101
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Post new topic   Reply to topic    Northwest Kiteboarding -> Gorge / Portland / Oregon Coast
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Nak

Since 19 May 2005
4199 Posts
Camas
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PostTue Apr 14, 15 7:32 pm     Reply with quote

The problem with lowering the stabilizer is that the turbulence generally drops.

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C Johnson

Since 17 Apr 2009
853 Posts
Seattle
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PostWed Apr 15, 15 6:57 am     Reply with quote

It'd be cool to see how something with the primary lifting wing in back and the stabilizer in front might work.

   108796.jpg 

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Nak

Since 19 May 2005
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PostWed Apr 15, 15 8:56 am     Reply with quote

That's an interesting thought. That would get the stab out of the turbulence. I'm not sure how much turbulence the stab would throw off. Plus, both surfaces would ideally be lifting surfaces. I would think it would be well worth trying.

I envy guys like Stringy who can take their ideas and turn them in to reality. Much respect.

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argos

Since 07 Apr 2010
66 Posts

 



PostWed Apr 15, 15 11:11 am     Reply with quote

Pepi wrote:
stringy wrote:
this thread has way too much text...
and let's stop the pissing contest before it starts


Agreed. Excess tech talk is best left to beach discussions or one on one off of the forum.

Foiling is fun, that's all I have to say.


I'm enjoying the tech talk. So much more interesting than some of the stuff on here: especially some of the shameless self promotion. Nak doesn't have a dog in the fight. He's just into the science like a lot of us on here. We don't make a living from this industry, but we spend LOTS of money on it.

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blancoh2o

Since 15 Mar 2005
1153 Posts
Oregon
Phishy



PostWed Apr 15, 15 2:50 pm     Reply with quote

C Johnson wrote:
It'd be cool to see how something with the primary lifting wing in back and the stabilizer in front might work.


I think that is the type of plane John Denver crashed.

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C Johnson

Since 17 Apr 2009
853 Posts
Seattle
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PostWed Apr 15, 15 5:39 pm     Reply with quote

looks like you're right.

Its a Routan Long EZ

According to wikipedia he crashed because he ran out of fuel and was unable to reach the reserve lever. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Denver

Somebody in the Hood River area has one of these planes. I've seen it doing some pretty advanced maneuvers over the event site. Cool looking planes, I thought it was a scan eagle from insitu at first but it seemed way too big.

Fun fact. Virgin Galactic partnered with Routan for their commercial space flight program. And of course if you're a kiteboarder you should know who owns Virgin Galactic Wink

Okay back on topic. foils. innovation. outside boxes. discuss!

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GregK

Since 21 Jan 2010
14 Posts
Comox, BC
 



PostWed Apr 15, 15 9:04 pm     Reply with quote

Gents / Nak : optimizing foil design could be done either by a) actual build & try experimentation or b) water flow tank testing probably on scaled models as you have suggested, but there's a third option - CFD ( computation fluid dynamics ) analysis. Would probably also want to run a solids FEA on the foil structure to understand how the wings and mast deflect under operation.

Optimizing kitefoil design would make a great thesis project for a mech-eng grad student ...

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J.P.

Since 10 Mar 2005
638 Posts

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PostThu Apr 16, 15 6:43 am     Reply with quote

argos wrote:

I'm enjoying the tech talk. So much more interesting than some of the stuff on here: especially some of the shameless self promotion.


I couldn't agree more!!!

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John

UPWIND LAUNCH OF A SPORT

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J.P.

Since 10 Mar 2005
638 Posts

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PostThu Apr 16, 15 9:23 am     Reply with quote

C Johnson wrote:
It'd be cool to see how something with the primary lifting wing in back and the stabilizer in front might work.


It might be a solution for those that can't get the whole "Pressure and balance on the front foot thing" Very Happy

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John

UPWIND LAUNCH OF A SPORT

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J.P.

Since 10 Mar 2005
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PostThu Apr 16, 15 9:32 am     Reply with quote

C Johnson wrote:

I also think there is still a lot to be learned about intelligent flex in foils and using flex to make the ride more forgiving. It seems right now everyone is focused on making everything as ridgid as possible to help with control. I think flex and proper loading in the right areas could be a really good thing for stability.


No argument on that point.

Windsurfers within this conversations can tell you that a good wave fin's tip flexes. Very Happy

Speaking of flex, by my recollection, it took a good ~5 years for the manufactures to figure this one with regards to our kite boards.

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John

UPWIND LAUNCH OF A SPORT

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J.P.

Since 10 Mar 2005
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PostThu Apr 16, 15 10:28 am     Reply with quote

C Johnson wrote:
It'd be cool to see how something with the primary lifting wing in back and the stabilizer in front might work.


That or something completely different. Very Happy


   foil_bidi3.jpg 
   20150117_134021_resized.jpg 
   FKTTjump.jpg 

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John

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J.P.

Since 10 Mar 2005
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PostMon Jul 06, 15 12:17 pm     Reply with quote

That or something completely different and influenced by nature. Very Happy

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   1.jpg 

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John

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