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Foiling tips for downwind and toe side

 
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SpaceRacer

Since 04 Nov 2007
434 Posts

Obsessed



PostMon Aug 24, 15 9:17 pm    Foiling tips for downwind and toe side Reply with quote

Are there any tips for this? I have been playing with my foot positioning on downwind. I think experimenting with moving a little further back but not certain if it is helping. Thoughts? Also, what makes a foil just all of a sudden drop? It's like your cruising along. Nothing changes but the foil suddenly breaks plane, makes a toilet flushing sound and you're down?

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Pepi

Since 16 Jun 2006
1831 Posts
Pure Stoke Sports
Shop Owner

CGKA Member


PostMon Aug 24, 15 9:36 pm     Reply with quote

2 things come to mind on this question.

1) When you are going downwind at a high speed, there is a need to progressively tilt your weight forward, as the wings will want to start to lift more and you will actually want to tilt the wings a tad bit forward so as to lift in a forward angle. The lift from the wings should be pulling you at a more forward angle to prevent from wanting to lift you straight upwards. (A bit hard to explain in text, would be easier to explain in person)

2) Gurgling - that is likely your back wings hitting the surface of the water and cavitating (sucking air) breaking the laminar/venturi flow around the wings. The sudden loss of lift or tracking makes you suddenly either drop or lose balance. Riding a bit lower in the water helps prevent this until you develop a comfortable level of control rolling over the backs of swells and into the troughs.

Had a very interesting discussion with Adam Koch about this today when I was discussing with him some of the issues I had during the blowout with super gusty winds and larger swell conditions. More pressure is felt in the upper section of the swell and less pressure is felt at the bottom of the swell (and back of the swell). It takes some time to get a rythm for how to roll though these on a downwind angle. (Upwind is quite different as you are slicing though on a oppositional course).

Sorry for the babbling. Best I could describe via a quick post.

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wylieflyote

Since 30 Jun 2006
1634 Posts
Puget Sound & Wa. Coast
XTreme Poster



PostTue Aug 25, 15 3:42 am     Reply with quote

Pepi wrote:
2 things come to mind on this question.

2) Gurgling - that is likely your back wings hitting the surface of the water and cavitating (sucking air) breaking the laminar/venturi flow around the wings. The sudden loss of lift or tracking makes you suddenly either drop or lose balance. Riding a bit lower in the water helps prevent this until you develop a comfortable
Sorry for the babbling. Best I could describe via a quick post.


"Giant Sucking Sound" and we're not talking about Ross Perot, has been the story of 2015 for me. I hear that sound and I'm on my face, hard. For me it's the most frustrating piece of the foil puzzle as most times it's "Where did that come from?".
In an odd way, this slow progression is precisely why I love foiling more than anything I've done in decades. Kinda like golf, with river nose Smile

I'm wondering if during the pro races and you see 3 dozen foilers screaming along at 30+ this is why you'll occasionally see huge spray-bomb crashes.

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Kip Wylie

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dcfordo

Since 19 May 2011
60 Posts
The Dalles
 



PostTue Aug 25, 15 5:29 am     Reply with quote

Sounds like you are letting the wing come up out of the water. But it seems like that would be obvious to you. Is your wing still deep when this happens?

On the other hand, leaning back while going fast down wind would certainly bring your wing up, so maybe that's it. I have to move my weight forward more the faster I go, as Pepi says, to counter the increasing lift.

Racers with big foil kites will edge away from their kites on a deep broad reach down wind, which looks like leaning back, but that is a completely different technique and situation. I assume you are simply following a drifting kite nearly straight down wind like most of us mortals.

Last edited by dcfordo on Tue Aug 25, 15 1:00 pm; edited 1 time in total

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SpaceRacer

Since 04 Nov 2007
434 Posts

Obsessed



PostTue Aug 25, 15 11:18 am     Reply with quote

Thanks all. Makes sense. Interesting Pepi what you said about the different pressure on different parts of a swell. I swore that my foil was sort of undulating up and down on swells but thought that I was doing in my mind or inadvertently as I approached swells. Fun stuff to learn and figure out for sure. Thanks

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